#ceph IRC Log

Index

IRC Log for 2014-02-07

Timestamps are in GMT/BST.

[0:02] * wrale (~wrale@wrk-28-217.cs.wright.edu) has joined #ceph
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[0:04] <wrale> I'm preparing a private 10GbE network switch for a ceph + openstack cluster. Each hypervisor (slash osd host) has a single 10GbE port NIC... I'm thinking I'll use VLAN tagging (as in VLAN 30 for storage replication, VLAN 40 for "compute").. on to my question:
[0:05] <geraintjones> Anyone used fusion-io cards for journals ?
[0:06] <wrale> Is it wise to setup QoS at the switch level for these two VLANs? It seems with the "ETS" option on my mellanox sx1024 that I'd be dedicated a flat percentage to each VLAN.. That seems suboptimal.. Maybe I'm missing something.. Anyone deal with these questions before?
[0:06] <bens> ooh what would happen
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[0:09] <wrale> I don't mind giving Openstack 80% of bandwidth in times of resource contention, but when contention against the 100% ceiling isn't the case, I want ceph replication to get >20%
[0:09] <wrale> As in, let ceph use the bandwidth if openstack isn't using it.
[0:10] <geraintjones> the ETS QoS will only kick in when you hit saturation
[0:10] <wrale> ah..
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[0:10] <geraintjones> so if you define a queue with 80% then it will get 80% when your pushing 100%
[0:10] <wrale> geraintjones: thank you.. new to QoS.. glad to hear it makes sense :)
[0:10] <geraintjones> but if all other queues are empty that 80% q would get 100%
[0:11] <wrale> excellent
[0:11] <geraintjones> Ivan Pepelnjak < read his stuff
[0:11] <geraintjones> http://blog.ipspace.net/2010/09/introduction-to-8021qaz-enhanced.html
[0:11] <wrale> do you think it wise to give openstack higher rank than ceph replication?
[0:11] <wrale> for a computationally-heavy cluster
[0:12] <geraintjones> if your going to be pushing a lot over the wire for openstack, yes
[0:12] <wrale> cool.. thanks.. will read up on the link
[0:12] <geraintjones> Personally I have no QoS, because we limit our clients to 1gbe
[0:13] * rturk-away is now known as rturk
[0:14] <wrale> that's a cool idea.. the consumers of this this cluster are doing hadoop-like things, ad-hoc.. i'm hoping to avoid their complaints during failed disk events
[0:14] <geraintjones> His webinars/videos are really good if you can get the money to pay for them :)
[0:15] <geraintjones> I currently have a cluster re-replicationg, and users are bitching - but network is not our bottlekneck
[0:15] <geraintjones> Disk io is :)
[0:16] <wrale> ah.. right on :) ... i'm not sure what to expect with disk io... it's going to be about 67 nodes of 2*3TB OSD.. hoping for the best :)
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[0:16] <wrale> luckily i'll have 1*240GB SSD for workspace to fall back on
[0:16] <wrale> in each
[0:17] * rturk is now known as rturk-away
[0:17] <wrale> i'm thinking spark will run better than hadoop by far in my cluster.. lots of ram
[0:18] <wrale> well, thanks for the help.. gtg
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[0:20] <wrale> (guess i should probably put the journal on the ssd, too).. lol later
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[2:43] <plut0> how is zfs development with ceph?
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[8:36] <shimo> is there any way to make ceph-deploy work without a proper dns?
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[8:38] <shimo> i'm trying to create a local cluster on a single machine, purely for development use
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[8:50] <shimo> (for app development purposes, not ceph development)
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[8:52] <lupu> shimo you can use /etc/hosts for name resolution
[8:53] <shimo> i tried, but it doesn't seem to work any better (still getting UnableToResolveError)
[8:56] <lupu> 192.168.x.x osd01.mydomain.com osd01
[8:57] <lupu> will always resolve osd01 or osd01.mydomain.com to ip
[9:00] <shimo> okay, solved.. my problem was that i was trying to make the /etc/hosts entries resolve to 127.0.x.x
[9:01] <shimo> which i assumed would work because it's the same machine, but guess not
[9:01] <shimo> thanks!
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[10:46] <Yannovitch> hi there !
[10:46] <Yannovitch> anybody here ?
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[11:11] <singler> Yannovitch: I am, but I doubt, that I'll be able to help.. :)
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[11:14] <Yannovitch> u never know ^^
[11:14] <Yannovitch> i installed ceph 0.76 ( so the upcoming firefly release)
[11:15] <Yannovitch> on CentOS
[11:15] <Yannovitch> and now I try to integrate it with OpenStack
[11:15] <Yannovitch> but it's not working
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[11:53] <srenatus> Hi there. Planning our cluster, we'd like to use the cache pooling feature, dev/cache-pool in the docs... is that possible with emperor?
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[12:19] <jcsp> srenatus: afaik it's a firefly thing only
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[12:20] <jcsp> but not long to wait for that :-)
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[13:02] <srenatus> jcsp: thanks.
[13:03] <srenatus> ceph.com/debian-firefly = 404. well, it was worth a try.
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[13:23] <srenatus> http://gitbuilder.ceph.com/ceph-deb-wheezy-x86_64-basic/ref/v0.75/ good enough for me.
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[13:29] <singler> try 0.76
[13:30] <srenatus> nothing there. where could I find that?
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[13:33] <singler> oh, maybe it was not packaged yet. There was announcement 3 days ago about 0.76 release
[13:48] <srenatus> yes, I saw that... any way around building my own?
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[14:30] <srenatus> http://gitbuilder.ceph.com/ceph-deb-wheezy-x86_64-basic/ref/master/ ok..
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[15:53] <srenatus> hmm or not. won't work on precise.
[15:54] <srenatus> s/wheezy/precise/. of course.
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[15:59] <jmancuso> Hi, I'm a bit new to ceph and am currently browsing the to better understand the architecture but there are a couple of points of confusion I was hoping you could clear up
[15:59] <jmancuso> Hi, I'm a bit new to ceph and am currently browsing the docs to better understand the architecture but there are a couple of points of confusion I was hoping you could clear up
[15:59] <loicd> could someone please confirm that http://wiki.ceph.com/Community/Meetups displays a page including "Montreal" near the top ? Someone is having trouble displaying the page and I'd like to confirm it should work.
[16:00] <loicd> jmancuso: ask away, I'll try to answer ;-)
[16:01] <jmancuso> Thanks Loic. Normally in most storage systems a "pool" contains your block storage devices which you can add and remove however with ceph it does not seems like that is the design. I'm not understandign teh mapping between pools and OSDs
[16:03] <jmancuso> I don't see how to add an OSD to a pool so I assume I am misunderstanding how they work: http://ceph.com/docs/master/rados/operations/pools/
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[16:20] <fghaas> jmancuso: yes you are misunderstanding something. you're missing the fact that pools are just *logical* subdivisions of your object store, which are rather quite detached from your physical OSD layout
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[16:22] <jmancuso> ok. so why would I want more than 1 pool?
[16:22] <jmancuso> and should I just use the default pool?
[16:24] <Gugge-47527> a pool cointains some placement groups, those placement groups are palaced on osd's according to the crushmap
[16:24] <Gugge-47527> you could have one pool using fast osd's, and one using slow osds
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[16:25] <Gugge-47527> or you could have 10 pools, using the same osds, but have a different customer using each pool
[16:26] <fghaas> jmancuso: you might want to take a look at http://ceph.com/docs/master/architecture/, or if that's a bit too detailed, you can check out this explanation: http://youtu.be/IrKyw6Hu8tU?t=5m55s (takes about 10 minutes of your time)
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[16:28] <jmancuso> If you can't assign specific OSDs to pools than how can you "you could have one pool using fast osd's, and one using slow osds"
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[16:30] <mattch> jmancuso: crush maps let you do this - have a read of http://www.sebastien-han.fr/blog/2012/12/07/ceph-2-speed-storage-with-crush/
[16:31] <jmancuso> ahh, now we are getting somewhere. thanks
[16:32] <fghaas> jmancuso: your question is answered at around the 11:00 mark in that video, and the "fast pool, slow pool" example is actually a somewhat advanced use of crush and pools, a simpler example is "pool A: 3 replicas per object, pool B: 2 replicas per object"
[16:34] <jmancuso> I will watch the video. thanks so much
[16:34] <jmancuso> in addition: http://ceph.com/docs/master/rados/operations/crush-map/
[16:35] <fghaas> that last one is not one I'd recommend for a ceph novice, except a very motivated one :)
[16:35] <jmancuso> haha ok
[16:36] <fghaas> don't get me wrong, the doc is fine, it's just a bit involved
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[17:01] <kitz> Just installed a new cluster. When I run "service ceph stop osd.0" I get "/etc/init.d/ceph: osd.0 not found (/etc/ceph/ceph.conf defines , /var/lib/ceph defines )". *Should* I go manually create entries in ceph.conf or should that be working?
[17:03] <fghaas> is this an ubuntu box kitz?
[17:03] <kitz> yup
[17:03] <kitz> 13.10
[17:03] <fghaas> stop ceph-osd id=0
[17:03] <fghaas> manage the osd through the upstart job, not the sysv wrapper
[17:04] <kitz> ah. I'm not yet familiar with upstart. thanks, fghaas.
[17:05] <fghaas> kitz, np
[17:06] <fghaas> I think the sysv init script was never fixed up for how ceph-deploy now leaves ceph.conf mostly empty, because the ceph daemons now use reasonable defaults for just about every config option
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[17:48] <kitz> I'd like to encode my SSD journal disks into my CRUSH map. I'm guessing I should make a new bucket type for that. Can I add the bucket type via `ceph osd crush` and get everything else reordered or should I dump->decomplie->edit->recompile->import for that?
[17:50] <kitz> I'm thinking that I don't *really* need to do that as my hosts are >= my replica size but, if/when I move to erasure this seems like it will be better to do.
[17:50] <kitz> But there was also something about ceph using crush to intelligently mark groups of devices down so maybe it is a good idea anyway?
[17:53] <saturnine> If I move an OSD disk to another host/slot, will Ceph automatically pick up on that change, or is there some configuration involved?
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[18:09] <Gugge-47527> kitz: you want to use your ssd's as osd's and not journals anymore?
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[18:14] <fghaas> saturnine: it won't care about a different slot, but will care about a different host, if I'm not mistaken
[18:15] <fghaas> but moving an OSD to a different host seems a bit silly, just take it out (ceph osd out), kill it, and ceph-deploy a new osd
[18:16] <fghaas> s/, kill it/, wait for data to replicate off, kill it/
[18:16] <kraken> fghaas meant to say: but moving an OSD to a different host seems a bit silly, just take it out (ceph osd out), wait for data to replicate off, kill it, and ceph-deploy a new osd
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[18:20] <Gugge-47527> why move data around twice when one time will do? :)
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[18:23] <saturnine> fghaas: Yeah, I figured that would be the case. thanks. :D
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[18:37] <fghaas> np saturnine
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[20:06] <kitz> Gugge-47527: No. I want to encode them as failure domains within crush.
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[20:07] <kitz> right now, i have three OSD hosts and so it isn't a big issue. I am looking forward to erasure encoding though and that will likely mean multiple shards ending up on a single host. If that happens then I'd rather those shards not end up on OSDs that share a journal SSD.
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[20:18] <Sysadmin88> erasure coding sounds lovely... but have they found if it will make things slower? possibly only use it for archiving...
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[21:15] <kitz> Sysadmin88: my hope is that i can turn my SSD journals into a cache pool for erasure coded HDDs and then it won't matter so much.
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[22:49] <wrale> here is a great webinar about ethernet quality of service (in reference to my question yesterday about such) https://www.brighttalk.com/webcast/6205/66627 (unfortunately, requires free sign-in)
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[23:20] <loicd> dupont-y: http://tracker.ceph.com/issues/7367#note-3 it indeed looks like two bugs ;-)
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[23:35] <wrale> i'm curious to know if anyone here can give me a good suggestion on what bounds to place on replication networking... for example, using rough numbers, i came up with the conclusion that 6.8Gbps is required to send 3TB in an hour, supposing write of 125MBps (fat chance, i think).. each osd server will have two 3TB drives.. basically, what is a reasonable timeframe for a drive rebuild? I'll use that Gbps in QoS policy if achievable.. (one 10GbE link
[23:35] <wrale> is being shared between compute and ceph replication, separated by tagged vlans) (for an openstack-like environment).. bluh..lol
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[23:40] <wrale> i was thinking of using 2Gbps for the replication policy .. if everything were in motion, and a server had to be rebuilt from nothing, the two 3TB drive, if full (looking at simplified scenarios) should take about seven hours... that seems like an awfully long time... hmmm
[23:40] <wrale> *drives
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[23:41] <wrale> (and that's in a best-ish case scenario, aside from full OSDs)
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